Episode 107- Larry Bunner, the X-Flight and flying in the moment

Glen Volk over the Okanagan

We’ve had a LOT of amazing talks on the Mayhem over the past bunch of years but this one is in a category of its own. Last summer Larry Bunner and three other very experienced Hang Gliding pilots (Glen Volk, Robin Hamilton, and Pete Lehmann) flew from the Gulf of Mexico to the Canadian border in a series of tow and mountain launch flights over 21 days (1884 miles) and 11 States. They were supported by an amazing crew on the ground and allowed themselves lateral shifts, but all South to North travel was done in the air. This was an incredibly cool mission and it sounded like amazing fun was had by all, but in the course of the talk we also learn some terrific advice and hear some great stories from a pilot who’s been flying 45 years (accident free). Larry’s advice applies to everyone who flies (and there’s some life advice in this one that probably applies to everyone). What do all the best pilots have in common? How do you become “excellent”? How does flying change your life? How do we negotiate the inevitability of finishing projects? Do yourself a favor- DON’T MISS THIS ONE!

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Show Notes:

  • Larry explains what the X-Flight mission was last summer
  • “To be excellent you’ve got to have an excellent plan”
  • What attribute do all of the best pilots share?
  • Larry gets into flying…45 years ago
  • How has flying changed Larry’s life?
  • How to balance life and flying
  • What the Hang Gliders know that paragliders don’t
  • The big negotiation
  • What happens when the big missions end?
  • Missions present, past and future
  • The 50 hour question…

Mentioned in this episode:

Robin Hamilton, Larry Bunner, Jayne Depanfilis, Foundation for Free flight, Rick Mullins, Glen Volk, Mike Degtoff, David Glover, Sasha Hamilton, John Enrietti, Bruce Goldsmith, AirTribune, Alistair Dickie, Patagonia, Matt Beechinor, Nate Scales, Willi Canell, Steven Kotler, Mick Howard, Greg Ludwig, Gary Osoba, X-Flight, Larry Tudor, Will Gadd, Christian Ciech, Jonny Durand, Jeff Shapiro, Dan Pointer, Wills Wing, Bowen Dwelle, Kevin Kristoferson, Ben Abruzzo, Aaron Beck, Jaro Krupa, Nick Greece, Antoine Laurens, Rafael Saladini, Marcelo Prieto, Dustin Martin, Bruce Weaver, Steve Pearson, Harry Martin



Robin Hamilton over King Mountain, Idaho

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Episode 107- Larry Bunner, the X-Flight and flying in the moment

00:00:30 - 00:05:05

Hi there everybody. Welcome to another very cool episode of the cloud base. Ma'am I have been promising you all more hanging shows have been very slack in doing that. In this one was just a ripper. Sat Down with Larry Buehner it. who was the mastermind and one of the four pilots who pulled off the ex white this last summer in twenty one days eleven states? They went from the Gulf of Mexico to the Canadian border They never used their cars to advance. They would only Go either collaterally eastern West kind of chasing the weather and just an awesome super inspiring mission and the got some great images. They raised a much money for breast cancer. It was just super cool. Incredibly inspiring Larry's been flying for forty five years. I've never had an accident so there's just a lot of great information mation in this. I think you're gonNA really enjoy it. And one of the most. I mean all the conversations we have here on. The mayhem are terrific but this one was kind of an elite. It's really enjoyed it. It was was painful cutting it off before I get into a whole bunch of housekeeping also. Just wanted her mentioned that he wanted me to give a special shout out to their tug drivers. A bunch of people that made this happened not just pilots. Obviously but they're tug driver guy name Rick Mullins who you'll see in the show notes Obviously couldn't have done it without. They did a lot of towing I think something like. They contacted. Eighty two airports to pull this off so very very very cool Before we get into the show I got a whole list of housekeeping items here as we descend on the holidays. The first is weird one. I bought a tow systems winch out of Slovenia many years ago that we had on the boat all those years did a bunch towing as I was sailing around the world. I left that at a friend's house in Malaga Spain. It's been sitting in his basement. I don't even know if he knows it's there but it's in pretty good shape. The line is the line on things worth a thousand bucks easy so if anybody needs a winch. And they're in Spain. I would love to hand this off to somebody who's at least gonNA use it so this has been sitting there for years. I've been trying to figure out what to do it. And obviously not gonNA use it so if you're in need of a win and you're in Spain or can get spayed. Give me a shout and can reach me through the website cloud base may dot com or any of my other channels Secondly the foundation for free flight. So those of you who fly in North America you may not be aware foundation preflight. This is run by volunteers. Only they make access and site protection and they do a whole lot. A lot of behind the scenes stuff to let us fly. So they have been a major proponent and part of the reason that we're able to fly especially North America's so When it comes to lobbying drones and all kinds of stuff they are critical and they have a great campaign going right now? Where anything you give to them? They're nonprofit obviously but they need money to protect sites and protect access and improve site was the kind of the main things they do. They also raise money for the world's demon the next helps teams and that kind of thing so I've done a lot of great stuff with over the years. They're fantastic people than any other sport. But they've got a generous donor right now. Who's going to match up to fifty thousand thousand dollars? That's given to them so right now your money goes you're going to get doubled. This is in my show notes for this For this episode and you can also find got more Google Foundation for free. Find out all about that but it is attested giving season and you can help them out. It would be great if you're a pilot and you care about free flight really really need to be given them as much as you can the Lascaux the ask anything. Show on a lot of great feedback for that people really enjoyed it. It was great to be able to reach. Reach out to other people with questions that I couldn't answer very expertly so we had some great responses about goal. Bruce Goldsmiths his talk talk about the challenges with being lighter pilot in competitions and other STA bruce's just fantastic person that knows so much about this sport especially about glider design obviously in the head of Bruce Goldsmith designed so he is running. I believe it's their third weightless comp this January down in Colombia Mbia. And if you're looking for a really great way to get access you know if you're wanting to learn more about competition flying and have really supported way to do it and also find why now more about this kind of weight issue. They have one of their weightless cops coming up in Columbia and they're still some spots so check that out just you can and find out more about an on Air Tribune and other fantastic resource so check that out.

00:05:05 - 00:10:05

Reach out to Bruce or Anthony. More information finally some giveaways as I've got to fantastic you. Maybe you've heard a blue fly. Berrios that ouster dickey makes he sent me quite a few these way way back when I still have two more and I would like to be able to give those away to you the listener and I've also got a little pack of Patagonia friends and family discount cards. These are worth forty percent off on almost everything so few exclusions like wet suits and stuff but anytime they're not having a sale this it's basically like a pro deal and they are. They've given me the nod to be able to give these out to you the listener. So what we're GONNA do for these. Is Anybody that it shares a show or gives us review on Itunes stitcher spotify. Harvey listened to the PODCAST. Is You Jarrett with your friends if you follow me on Instagram instagram. This show will be on Instagram facebook. And it'll be on twitter so Those are all if you just Google cloud based mayhem find those but on Instagram Gavin. McClurg Org on facebook. It's cloud based Ma'am on twitter's cloud-based Ma'am so fine. This show share it with your friends track. All those and everybody shares it or it gives us a rating or does something other that some of the way that I haven't thought of to kind of get this podcast out there and get this show out there. What this is all about in his always been about is just sharing knowledge? Trying to make us safer better pilot so It really really does help when you don't just listen what you tell your friends about it or talk about on the way to launch. It might just be sending me an email. Hey Man I talk about this thing all the time. I'd love to be in this drawing so and before the next show I or maybe two shows from now sometime in January. I'll drop all those people into a hat. You don't have one of my neighbors here that I fly with. You will hear nate or Matt or somebody. Just draw out of the hat and we'll give all these things way so again. A couple of blue fly barrios. These audio varies. That are awesome dickey makes on one hundred bucks a pop and then a bunch onto these family and friends discount cards so jared Shared love. We appreciate it very much and now let's get into the show with Larry. This is fantastic. You're I'm GONNA DIG it. I will do more shows. Hang Gliders I've been like I said I've been blacks in doing that so we'll get that back up to speed enjoy. Larry really excited Dahbi on the show. I'm sorry this has taken so long all of my traveling but Excited you reached out to me because I've been needing to and promising to do more more hang shows and this is a great opportunity because you guys did a really cool mission this last summer and I'd love to hear more about it. You call it to expedite Tell me about the X. Y.. And what it was all about flight. actually solicited. A bunch of friends Robin Hamilton. Who is Martin at the four pilots and I kinda did most of the logistics as far as planning goes in one of the things that we were kicking around was what we should call all this this journey and so we had queried entre hang gliding pilot friends in than settled on x flight x million? Dan Somewhat extreme and this being the initial journey decided to use the term then the visual part of having to hang gliders lighters bordered the logo. So that's how we came up with the name. Yeah very cool. I mean this is an ex APPs participant I dig it eighteen. Yeah that was a great read this year my heart my to my heart goes out to you for all of the challenges is that you encountered certainly made the ones that we that we encountered seem minor Mukta. Well yeah but it was a cool mission. You guys did so for those who aren't aware of it. What was it? What did you guys accomplish that we? It's it's remarkable. It's it's on a map. That looks awesome writer. Uh Well Several of US had been flying out of South Texas for a couple of years and on a personal level Bodmin across country pilot my entire forty five years applying and I compete mainly to try and improve during my skills so that I can fly farther faster and mchower who's in south Texas kind of set up a Zapata Lake Take Cross country excursion and of using a tug pilot. Greg Ludwig initially we were located in in in referral Texas which is just northwest of Corpus.

00:10:05 - 00:15:22

Christi in we have some good flights there but they weren't quite as good. Good is what you could get out of Zapata Never Mendoza Potter mainly because of the safety issues. Related defy out there just many stories of the first fifty miles being very very tough to get retrieved and I noticed Rhode Island's who had some significant issues after landing out early and so we located this old sailplane soaring board called Brookefield in referral in started flying out of there we had Some pretty good flights The weather wasn't quite epic but I ended up with a two hundred and fifty miler four hundred kilometer flight Two years ago and my challenge to us to determine whether I still had it in me to go long distance for a long time in I cannot slay aid that dragon high fifty nine thirty four minutes on that year naive be only thing that put me on. The ground was the setting being son so probably didn't maximize the front end of the day is much is Is I could have done. It's all part of the learning experience of flying down. It's time time it properly so that you can get data early window and that you guys seem to manage very very well. It's not quite it is Easy for us in in the hang gliders but dumb just mainly because Retrieve you know if you go ten miles out of your days almost most shot by the time you get retrieved get broken down take go back to the airport set. Backup it all your gear configured properly. You've lost a couple of hours significantly shorter day so but anyway to go back to the genesis of mission last year the over kicking around in my mind what was next for Larry. Boehner and You know I'm sixty five years old now. I still have this immense passion to to fly gliders and I thought man we've had such good success here out of south Texas wouldn't it be cool if we could just keep going the only man so over the winter I kind of started putting it together in initially I was GonNa do it by myself. which was somewhat foolhardy bet? I started asking tow pilots around the country. What what they thought I would need to be successful to fly Almost two thousand miles north to Canada and one one toe pilot that I talked to is edible hieaux in He gave me some really. Oh good feedback. He had a five eighty to try and he. He told me that he could set it up. The entire down is set it up in twenty minutes. Tear down in about the same amount of time but you would need help on the tear down like Oh okay. And so I said at the end of the conversation. I said if you know anyone that would be interested in doing this. Journey from South Texas to to Canada let me know in. He hesitated for minute. Many said I do knows someone. I'll do it nice villa. He said Yeah. I'm retired too so this in venture that I can't pass up in so that started the ball rolling in lapsed a year ago in December Robin Hamilton called me. I don't know if you're aware of Robin's qualifications as a hang glider pilot holds multiple world records in different has held them in different types of gliders from the swift to topless in. I had flown with him at referral for two years. And we we got along really well and have for many years. Actually he was asking me last December about my I journey in where I was how far along it. I think it was going to happen and I said well yeah I do. I do believe it's going to happen. I have a tug pilot. You know I have a driver in You know I'm really geared up to go as far as Putting all of the logistics together that still a yet to be solved. Uh I have six months to do it so at the end of the conversation I asked him. I said well why are you. Why are you asking me? And he said Larry he said even when I was back back in Scotland my main mission was to fly cross country and I just love flying exceed. And I'd like to join you. You'll take someone on. I'm in two seconds. They said you're in you know so. What cornea yeah? And so eventually we did can build up to four people we had Glenn Volk from San Diego Robin Hamilton's from Houston and then Pete lame in his from Pittsburgh area and they all approached approach me and and I thought this'll work I just need to check with the tug pilot in Fortunately the tug pilot was ago he said hey career four or five toes.

00:15:22 - 00:20:09

It's not that big a deal will be done in the morning. I'll pack up and beyond the road following you guys shortly thereafter. This is a new term to me what. What's tug pilot? That's just your toe pot. That's that's who tells you we call our to- are aero towed by the tug. UGH and I didn't know that our toll pilots tug pilots That's cool I like that. Little little mariner the Little Mirror term. I liked US good. Yeah and so. There's four pilots. What are what are your rules? We did it like you know. I don't on golf anymore. But back in the day we would play best ball a group of four whoever hits ball of fire this and everybody had moved their ball up to that point Go again pick your next shot and that that would be the most efficient way to get to Canada. Within the limited limited somewhat limited time frame that we had so that was One rule that we established to his son of a few roles one was that we would use. He's the best flight of the day is next starting point on the other rules. Were that as much as we possibly. Could we would travel laterally early east or west to to stay at the same distance basically from Canada to fly from our next airport. Okay so you're always tone from the airport obviously make sense and and I know your map. It's on your facebook page. Yeah there was never ever any visible advancement. You're just you're just you're laterally Moving directly east or West crag right connotation weather yeah we did have to compromise at at a at a point during the journey to weather considerations but for the most part I think the total total distance ended up being being eighteen hundred and eighty four miles from from various Texas for initially took off from to What's that town up there and in Washington state you probably know well fine at Shallan wreck? Yeah Soyuz yeah. Yeah yeah all the way up to their whole what an amazing journey so and when you guys are towing are you. Are you able to. Kind of gaggle fly or you pretty much solo playing basketball or one of the one of the reasons for picking South Texas in foul furious in particular. Is that in the summer months. There's usually a lot of win win. Need to winter provide the fuel the long distance so I we did get on fly not all at once but on occasion. Glenn is Glenn Ball very good gaggle pilot. He's able to stick with pilots really well. I've never really never really perfected the technique which makes my my Competition results variable off on my own too much too fast and and so invariably but we self in situations for either. I'm really low for a long time or in and up decking it to answer your question because of the win there was a significant lag time. It's probably almost fifteen or twenty minutes. So that's twenty K. by uh-huh winning. That's tough to make up. What was the longest flight I believe it was a hundred fifty? Five miles out of Hobbs New Mexico. Yeah you know I had. I had Larry on the show a couple years ago. I need to get him back on. But that's where he got his three hundred mile or a believer. I often back in the ninety one of them for sure. Yeah we gotta get down there. You know we'll get set. The record record from their ages the paraglider. She's having been on that scene. So Hobbes is still happening. We contacted the well while to regress a little bit too as part of the planning I am somewhat of an anal planner. My philosophy about life is if you reach Excellence Flint's you have to have an excellent plan or an outstanding plan in my career as a I was in the nuclear field for thirty nine years and in the end I was responsible for planning outages which were twelve to seventeen.

00:20:09 - 00:25:08

Thousand tasks is performed in sixteen to twenty two days so in my my belief. Is that if you want to perform those tasks on time and you you gotta spend tremendous amount of time preparing before he ever shut the unit down kind of taken that with me in to hang gliding and actually in the pre world in in Mexico on I believe it was two thousand ten might have been twelve. I had an opportunity to interviews some of the top pilots in the world. Actually I talked with twelve of them and all of them had been competing in a very high level for a very long time in so I kept asking him the same question. It's been very successful for a long period of time. What is that one attribute that you have that allows you to fly so well so consistently Over this time period in almost to a person on they all answered but some general same thing. I fly in in the moment. I've focused on now. I don't let distractions impact my ability to fly. I'm thing was Christian. Check said I learned to fly the conditions early and there was only really one deviant from that and that was Johnny Durant. I don't know if you've had johnny on the show or not having I gotta get him on the show in Johnny said I have excellent vision which I thought was phenomenal Some expecting someone to say. Oh it's the glider or oh I climb really well and none of them said that the they all were very internal looking except for Johnny was external looking but and Johnny said I can see the flip of a bird's wing much further off in the distance. Johnson others that I fly with in. I've experienced that I mean he'll take off. I am like wearing a hat is where is she going. Yeah better better but yeah so anyway. To to fly in the moment my fossey tried to bring to the As a mentor to our our our our sport classic competition for Upcoming Competition Pilots. That are flying. The sport lighters in Florida is to sit down and share with them. That you know to get into the moment is very fleeting for most of us particularly for me. Yeah I remember had A. I had a flight nineteen eighty-seven where I flew hundred seventy six miles in king post to glider and my brother called me like two days later and slayer. That was so awesome. I'll bet that was the most difficult thing you've ever done in your life and nine Sarah that was so easy I mean everything just clicked so now I've been in the pursuit suit to kind of get myself into that moment but I've resolved. Is that in order to do that. I need to remove all of those distractions that impact impact my ability to focus that task at hand in season. We'll and what the heck does that mean in I tell him that you you know I we all need to. I need to fly with intent in intense. You know you'll know when you get it but intent. Means that they're saying that you're focused on the task at hand. So let are distractions. That distraction could be you. GotTa p distraction could be. You're Out late the night before he didn't get enough rest your head's not right could be equipment laid could be that you don't have your Aradio work or your instruments not working properly or your gliders not tune properly or your harness is not situated so that some most comfortable so there's things that you can go through that it can impact your ability to focus in so that that's That is my last. He and that's what I strive to do. You're out of shape so so in a sixty five a challenge for me CY workout for five days in a in a pretty intense environment to try and retain in what little muscle mass. I have left fast twitch muscles that have left but Have you have you read any Stephen Colour stuff on flow or for me. Hi checks chick. Sent me high and never say that his name right. He was kind of the one that I started writing about flow. But but what. I mean what you're describing is his to me is flow which is a little nebulous still. I realized but it's you know that kind of being in the moment and being Present is is very much described kind of flow state.

00:25:09 - 00:30:06

What the way the way you described being in the moment and all those pilots talking about that? I think that's one of the things that comes up a lot. On our one of the reasons it comes up a plot with pilots is. It's it I think for many for for pilots all pilots. It's kind of a cheat in the flow whether you I know you're in it or not or even know what flow is. It seems like flying. Something is hasn't intensity that you can kind of bypass us some of the things that need you need to go through to find flow and other areas because you can find flow and work. I've like you did maybe with your you know Work in the nuclear industry. You could find flow in a lot of ways doesn't have to be sporting but is that that's something to think about doing. I think end up I think it it's east related to all things in life. It can be a relationship it can be you know Your work it can be your sport. Golf is probably a good classic one for being in the zone. I mean getting into that zone in it's just Yeah so that's on my mind a lot. In fact I was just visualizing in my head when I'm flying you have all this stimuli in front of you and it's in it's really all about your ability to take all that input in and process it in an efficient manner so that you can then make your next decision decision to what you're GonNa do so yeah I think about how did you get into. How did you get into flying role and I'm in Northern Illinois. I have four brothers and we've been kind of An adventurous group for a flatland area like Illinois. We grew grew up with very few limits on. I can remember my mom saying in the eight o'clock in the morning we're headed out. She'd say all right. You boys be home by dinner and don't get your feet wet you know. So so what would we do. A Lotta away his man. That was the pressure right over with. Hopefully they would be dry by the time. We got home but we had some sand dunes down by Lake Michigan in in several of had dreams. And I know I still do about running leaping off the sand dunes and each step your your stride gets longer and longer until you're floating at the time. I was reading sports illustrated. This was probably in the early seventies and I saw in the back of the magazine Article About Hang Gliding in so we Sheridan shared it with my dad and my dad came home with a book by Dan. Dan owner about hang gliding and in the back of the book. There were four forty over forty manufacturers the US at that time. And this is like seventy depor. Maybe said He. Three in one of them happened being Milwaukee Wisconsin which was forty miles away so My oldest brother I was. I'm probably seventeen or eighteen at the time but my oldest brother. He went up to the manufacturer which was really guy building. Hang gliders in his garage up popular up your mechanics instructions in came back with a glider that he paid three hundred ninety five dollars for in so we all pitched in of course in in and we. We took to Warren Dunes Michigan on the other side of Lake Michigan where the sand dunes were bigger now prevailing. WESTERLIES would hit the slopes in. We taught ourselves out of fly in the how I got started. I still my brother. Rob Is the youngest. He's he's still flies and the other my other three brothers only dream about trying. They haven't gotten into it and you're forty five years of flight. They all did we all at some point but they've all moved on to better your the only one that stayed insane. Yeah no kidding How has it I mean this is? This is an absurd question. I'm asking anyway. How has it changed your life will? Aw being a family man with three children was married very early and had children very early in it was It was tough to to fly very much especially in northern Illinois were. There aren't any mountains or any appreciable size hills defy I also but there were some doubt reclose enough three hours away or whatever of wind up migrating there whenever we thought to conditions nations. Were good so that we could get some time and so I would characterize how it touted.

00:30:07 - 00:35:12

I've been so passionate about flying in so motivated motivated to get in the air but yet at the same time so patient for thirty four years to to be able to raise my kids and and make sure at the home on scene was taken care of that when night when they all finally did leave the nest and I retired as like it was very obvious to my wife but we were gonna GonNa do from then on and now. It's to fly as much as I possibly could. So so how has it changed my life. I'm I never really thought of myself as an athlete. I wasn't as fast as my brothers or as strong as my brothers in the book. Reader more of the sinker and the dreamer and I think what hang gliding bet hang gliding is done for me as it's allowed me to continue to strive to live that dream which I you had as a kid when I was running over the sand dunes so in fact you know Gavin everything I do today except for my relationship with my wife and family family is geared around hang gliding amine. It's maybe a little selfish but it's what my I WanNa do it until I can't and I have. I have friends that I fly with one is eight years old in. He still flies. He probably gets in fifty seventy five hours a year flying in in southern Wisconsin. So I always have this. These mentors out there that better showing me the way in and let me though that I that I can still do it. And the other one. The other friend that I fly within Wisconsin is seventy eight he advise a topless hang glider and the eighty year old lies on toes gliders fixed-wing but You got plenty of time. The meth right. Hope I do too to kind of summarize I think what hang hang gliding does is. It's given what it did for me. It's given me a pathway to experience things that most the people don't get a chance to experience and it's given me that that path and bad drives than to to follow that path. So yeah he has that balance between family and flying is that been easy. Hardly have you ever if you ever had to really kind of re-jigger and and listen. We've we need to straighten this out. I think a lot of people really struggle with that. Well you know. Certainly we had our moments about whether I should be going out flying on my day my only days off when I haven't been home and the industry that I worked in was pretty intense many twelve hour days. You know you're committing a lot of time to work and so there was this feeling decades hang gliding was pulling me away from the family so there were moments where you know i. I couldn't go when I wanted to all over the the good thing about staying are living in Northern Illinois. There's about six months where he can't fly anyway. So I called that bank power. That's when you do a real good job being a dad and husband and tailend story was nineteen eighty seven We had huge fires out west. That were huge drought. In the Mid West in the upper mid west of hot hot hot corn crops were just just beat down from all the heat in we would. My buddies tonight live from the local area. That two pilots from Wisconsin. I mentioned earlier. We would always migrate West to for week of flying when we started out going to Salt Lake Lake City where he could fly the point of the mountain in south north and fly some mountain sites round there. Commodore which was one of my favorites. But then we heard about Kevin Christopherson doing these big flights in Wyoming which shortened are driving. We could fly there so we started flying at whiskey peak which is on the eastern inside of the red desert or a data. I am not going to get the name of the desert out. There can't remember yes the ready to desert and it was just. I'm not really much of a mountain. It was only about fourteen hundred feet from a safe landing area and but the wind would blow their barrier run seven. AM is sweeping off the desert up the slope Western. Slow and Kevin would what I call. When do what I call troll? He would would launch in Ridge so until the first good sorry that he thought was good enough to leave lists would take him up high enough that he would lead in so we were lucky enough up to watch his exploits.

00:35:12 - 00:40:07

He set several world records from that site. Two hundred eighty seven miles. I believe the record. He had in nineteen eighty seven avenue and we started flying there and So we had a great week. It was hot hot hot there. I flew six hundred. Eighty the eight miles in seven days of flying lost ten pounds burn in the mid oil racing to get back to our hotel going back up the mountain and I can remember one day just flown finished playing two hundred mile flights than a role which I'd never done and I'm like lolly. Gagging around top amounted. My buddies irks slapping the ribs into the Clyde or as fast as they could because this blowing up. We're hearing thermal skin off already. They're like what are you. Aren't you GonNa Fly Mike now I I need a rest day in my but my buddy matt. WHO's the oldest? He's eighty now he looks over at me and it just gives me a a kind of Lear said I can't believe this and then went back Like all right so throw my glider together together and kickoff another hundred miler for at the end of the truck. We're headed back and usually in late August now early September and when a cold front start kicking through. That's our best flying in the mid mid West Pulse Front. It's Kinda cloud streets lineup. We have good woodwind and in high altitudes because the humidity is so much lower in the head. Get a call. So I'm just home from being gone a week worked a week. It's the next weekend I get a call early in the morning and Matt The my mentor says A. It's GonNa be a great day-today are you coming down to Harmon. Arto site said mom. I can't go with you. We just got back. I just got home. He says okay. Okay you're missing NYC an epic day in so I hung up and I'm just hoping around the house. Isn't it amazing how that happens. You just had this epic trapped in like I'm missing out on the Howson Sue finding looks at me and says what are you doing saw so often. I'm good. I'm good. She Goes No. You're not you're going to be this way all day long. I'll be okay I'll be. Oh can't you get outta here. Go Get out of here. She wasn't too happy but she said about the third time I had already had mature. I knew throwdown scrambled to get down there in Nance when I had my my longest flight at that time you got there I was ready to go at eleven forty five. They were already in the air gone and I can remember. We used a static system. We didn't use a winch Lynch in. I don't know if you're familiar with static toiling but I've heard about it. I've never seen it done. We'd lay twenty five hundred sheet out on a road in an attached to hydraulic cylinder to a pressure gauge on. That was Magnetically connected to the hood in the driver would drive by pressure on the line in. So we'd say go go go. And then he would take up to launch pressure and then back down to two towing wing pressure and I will never forget this. He's driving my vehicle to told me up any radios he says. Hey I'm the glide. The truck is stopped. Which meant I'm in thermal in then? I'm so I'm just screaming up at a thousand feet a minute. In all of a sudden radios he said a truck is in neutral in. Its backing up. The thermal was so strong it was poem the my my four or walk back in so I I knew it was as soon as I got dumped was going to have to get off in immediately turn because it was blown like twenty and so I did that and it was I was well beyond where launch from before I hit the edge. Armel in your committed. I mean you just have go in so I went in went for many many hours. A flood of the the last thermal. The last cloud dissipated did in glided around from there in Yeah so I mean the story was all about is how does this work out with family family. And it's a negotiation certainly is but you know it's funny after after this X.. APPs house really moping around the the mental side of it after an event like that and everything that goes into it.

00:40:07 - 00:45:02

Is You really come down kind of off a cliff at at the end and and at all month and a half later something we were still in Europe and I was dropping off all my supplements with a buddy of mine who was Really into the Tour de France and really no road biking and I thought well I don not gonNA need this stuff. This'll be my last acts up. I'm giving it all to him. And so matty my wife the fiance. At the time now my wife looked over at me the car what are you doing. I'm dropping off all this stuff I am going to give it away. She's so you're done with the exile. Yeah yeah non on done. She's not that smart. Good give up give up the thing you love the most keeps you from being mopey around the house. That's good that in hanging out with the you. You know you have the best time of your life doing these. That's a that's a good. I thought she was going to be like. Oh thank goodness you know this is great. I get you back back but Neto I think women are smarter. How enjoyed the my? My wife had never driven for me in all my flying while while I was working and as I was closing in on retirement. I'm she said so. How's this GONNA work in? I said well I'M I. I would like you to be my driver's though. We can do this in tandem together and she said you know she's thinking of all. You're the things that she normally does that. This was going to impact her. Take take her away from Nice. Well let me put it to you this way you if I fly fifty days a year than you get the other three hundred fifteen not I mean. I'm not kidding you're right. It's said you know what I think I can do that. So we started going to calm and she started driving for not just me but my friends to in a woman a woman would think this way but she she started packing wash. Wash cloths getting them wet. Put in plastic bags and when she pick somebody up. She'd run out with a wash cloth a- bottle of water and a beer in. Oh my gosh. She's the most favorite person everywhere I go. I'm I'm in love with you. You know he acts of course they are car. That's a dream so that's been I've been really blessed to have have that transpire in the retirement side of things that I've been at it now ten years so but Yeah it's a really good. That's terrific this. There's a lot of things that you just said last few minutes that I wanted tap back into but back to your expedition the X.. Flight you know on on paper a lot of it looked pretty tough. But I'm guessing that it was kind of like the flight you did and your brother said man that must have been the hardest thing ever dead and you think yeah now now not so much when you look back on it rhyming time changes. It changes everything my question. Is You know talk about that but also if you found it hard to have pulled something like that off looking forward. I'm curious about this because you're you're wiser than I am. I am just because of age. I'm forty seven near sixty five. You've been flying for forty five years something I think. I've certainly I am struggling with and I think a lot of others are as well as you know. We WanNA keep pushing it. We want to keep doing the X. flights but how do you you keep pushing it in come home yeah yeah. I sank Well I'll I'll go back to when you said you kind of when you finish accepts. This year was kind of like stepping off the cliff in a totally related to that. I mean the drive home in for two weeks I was just in his eye. Yeah it was. I was surprised by the fact that I was in this funk but yet I couldn't really do anything about it in fact I couldn't even process the previous three weeks. A flying that I've done in there are moments where I couldn't I couldn't Nima remember some of the flights and then finally all started coming back. Karen the stories with my friends in it was really cool. But yeah so when we when we finished Glenn Bolt in particular the pilot from San Diego he said. Hey what about next year. What are we going to do? This was so much fun I wasn't I wasn't even close to being ready to even think about it. Says Number One. The logistics said I was involved with Saint Kinetic Annette. I was going to do this by myself.

00:45:02 - 00:50:26

The planning our was I was it was taxing. It was much more taxing than the actual flying Eighty two airports on our path to make sure that we had permission a toll from those airports eighty one of them gave us the the okay which was very pleasant in a very surprising for me. Because I've been trying to fly from airports in the Mid West firm many years years Until era join started men it became much more natural. Never dreamed I would get that kind of reception from these. Airports spent much customer very rural. And you know well away from airspace. So obviously the population density is much less in as a result these airports are finding ways to survive and they actually welcomed us to come coming implored us to come in from their airport. Kumi on one airport. Said we'd like love you to be here and we'd like to make breakfast for you. So the townspeople come out and of course as in Esten esten paragliding for you to pick an airport that you think you're gonNA land and then to go do it when it's over. One hundred miles away is that improbable in yes. That's what we found is that you know we. I think one day it was our last asked today. We landed at an airport. Wait actually called so the rest of the time we're scattered all over the countryside but then we would. We would try to get to the airport that we had contacted in in going fly from there the next day. So but so is Glenn Glenn Tomi said Hey. Why don't we do the mountain version next? And I had already been mulling that over but man it was just too too quick for me and so I don't know that we'll do it in two thousand tourney. The dialogue about doing something in the mountains says can die down would that be with that similar kind of mission mission with IBM Yeah we were thinking again south high. What can I do that with you guys? That would be cool. I've been looking at some of the mountains sites in Arizona and New Mexico in This this would bring a whole new level of challenge in might For Hang for hang gliders we we had the advantage of this year of having a subtly push almost every day and in the mountains for the weather kinda amount the mountains themselves generally somewhat the conditions that you you get obviously the southerly flow than is much less predictable so But the channel it's it would still be a blast and we've been thinking about. We was still bring a tug along. We will try to mount fly from the mountains themselves launch from the mountains themselves in go north and only use tug as necessary. You know when we when we didn't have an option available local to us so that may happen it's still I think in its infancy. I have something that I wanNA do. And I've been thinking about this for a long time and and it is still an ex flight dream. I believe it's just on a different scale in that is I'd like to fly to toe to toll again. I actually have two real basement that I'm rebuilding to prepare for next year and then but toe in Iowa North North and South Dakota Montana to Kansas to set the state record for entry now some of them mm are pretty low. So wouldn't be that tough but yet at the same time I'm not I'm not interested in doing a thirty Mile John just at a record. I mean my vision would be you know. Do One hundred and fifty miles or hundred eighty miles to set that care. Way Out there for the next person person that wants to track. Yeah so I mean both. Both those missions are just weathered pen and Artha. You're you're you're traverse what the mountains is just is going to be at me now. Imagine you guys can just deal with a lot more weather in the mall. I know you again in the flats so as long as you have time just more waiting around on right right so yeah. So there's those are two things on my mind for future exploit in in. Uh there's probably some other ones out there I'm I'm thought about individual site records in that kind of thing. That's probably though one thing that fuels my desire to fly is is to try. And and do the best I can in an impossibly set a record at a site or a state or whatever can whip drives me right now your story about you guys flying that Kinda low site in Wyoming cross the red desert one one of my mentors and very good friend wicked pilot here locally guy named nate scales in a few years back.

00:50:26 - 00:55:01

I don't know who this was but he was talking to a sailplane in pilot and the salient pilots said. I don't understand why you guys aren't taking off from Battle Mountain and flying the Snake River conversions. The snake risk the plane. Convergence out here that we see all the time and file Jackson you know for sure you can set the record from there and so we started looking at that and and I have a friend down in Boise. Guinan air back. Who follows what you guys do? A lot and follows with sale. Plans are doing a lot and he's really good at looking can weather not gonNA thing and one of the things he's been Kinda jibing me about is you know you gotTa Talk to more of these hang gliders because they they have been doing this so much longer and they know all these sites and the not a lot of young hang gliders you know that this this knowledge is slowly disappearing when you. What are you guys collectively? You know. I I'm curious you know when you're having your coffee or your beer and all this kind of things. What are you guys talking about in terms of cash Josh? I don't understand why the paragliders aren't an ex. You know like that site you're talking about. I've never heard of that and we have been pouring over the maps. You know trying to find a place you know other than Zapata where we could go and try to crack off really big. You know those guys have been doing these big flights from lab and Porcupine Down Down in in Wyoming Utah where they fly across the flats. But they're always getting hit with this north. You know so. They got the westerly for the first seventy percent of the flight and they always get this north and then it's late then line up. The monsoon kills them until late August September. So we've lost those long days that you can do down in Saporta Oughta but I'm curious with your all your years and all your knowledge You know places King Mountain. They're just kind of fading MHM yeah I mean we know all about king mountain but there's just there's not many people I mean that's my backyard. We know about king but but there's places I'm sure sure like that. That are you know just aren't getting used as much anymore. Yeah I I don't know I think things are changing a little bit though. Oh here in the in the Midwest in the flats in particular we've got a really strong. A developing paraglider contingent engine Illinois is classic example. Yaro crew has air gliding or whatever. Whatever it's called and he's been breaking up some unbelievably long flights and I keep looking at my hang glider buddies going? What's going on? We need to get our real going again because we're we're missing out on these opportunities were limited somewhat by having only a a few Places not all of them are open every day in so we miss. We Miss Opportunities that that Yarl's taken advantage of I mean the most recent one just absolutely blew my mind is he flew on November fifth in all six weeks away solstice over one hundred miles. That was awesome. Yeah it's incredible to me so I think maybe You know that that what's happening here. Minnesota's having the same thing for they're out actively towing all the time that's GonNa Change in help the Midwest in particular as far as the mountains are concerned. I I'm not really that familiar with With some of some of the flights that have been made out there scales in particular and Nick Greece fine over the overnight and this was years ago but Yeah that sounds very intriguing to me or flying from MISSOULA UP TO NORTHERN I've actually mapped out a couple routes man. That would be so awesome to do that. See Shapiro actually fly that route that somebody most recently did from Missoula this WanNa Jeff's friends but but So I met sure you know I thought I. We heard rumors that there was gonna be some paraglider pilots in foul furriest and others another airport west at between fell furious in Zapata. That never gonNA be trying to set records but no I. Don't I think they were smart enough that they could see that.

00:55:01 - 01:00:02

The weather wasn't going to be epic. It wasn't going to be that supportive in one of our our one of the newer paraglider pilots who formerly was in a hang gliding actually had camped out in the The hill country was gonna fly from Lakey with the hopes of setting a record for a lower and paraglider and But I think it was too hard for him for his experience level. I think it was more than he can. He can handle so but we were communicating everyday about what are the conditions expect in in really for us spur expedite our conditions. Although we had many hundred mile flights almost averaged one hundred miles a day. We did not we had had. Maybe one epic day. That was the day out of Hobbs. In Um we never foresaw flying out hobbs. It wasn't even an airport that had contact lists because as we were thinking we were going to be further to the east flying in a plane up using the more southerly flow and we got eh boxed in by weather were on the route that we were gonNA take up through Oklahoma in so he had to divert to the West are probably one hundred. I'm fifty miles two hundred miles to get to hobbs after we flew out of junction. Texas in Luckily I mean conditions were great. We weren't prepared though Gavin because we said there's no way we're gonNA need oxygen on this trip don't bother bringing were staying in the plains at highest will get his ten thousand feet no maybe eleven over dinner big spring but now no need in sure enough at Hobbs ABS I. I thought we were GONNA get thirteen looking at the skew t diagram and we were getting to sixteen and spent spent hours above fourteen thousand. It was that good. So there's a story to go along with Glenn Ravin Talk to me later and said Hey you are hypotheses and I support. What do you mean well here on the radio on this is Larry Hey you guys sounded kinda funny too so but still. Yeah we were ill prepared and you know the worst thing about Oh two is not necessarily I mean a hydroxy is significant. It's it's the most is the worst thing but brought the cold. We weren't prepared for the cold. Either you know when your body starts to address the low to gear digits. Start getting cold I and and You know I know it chilled to the bone means I mean to call. That's just a cold that you you can't escape from two. Yeah so do you guys you guys start shaking so hard your gliders are shaken. That's what I always know really cold when the whole glider you're shaking so yes so That was probably the most challenging day but yet the it was the the most fun we were in the vicinity together the entire time. In fact I think we all ended up at one hundred fifty five mile mark something like that. It landed in separate field said several times spent. But it's really cool to you. Guys did that when you did. Because I was was over when he did that I was over at the house. But we had in the rockies. This year the weather was brutal. I I was just so wendy and you guys can handle lot more than we can but As you meet you guys real such a cool mission when most of us were grounded it all. Summer just wasn't dizzy a tough year. A lot of wind. Yeah you know it was even Not that great for us. I mean we we made do with what we could but there was so much moisture even in Colorado Kansas Oklahoma. I just I was wet. Wet Wet in fact we finally got Colorado we Meiomi CINCO IS ROB enter. One of US said man. This is this. This is like Minnesota Land of ten thousand lakes is just bought. Everywhere in Wyoming in particular was dark green. I'd never seen it. That way you know must have been beautiful because we were so close to. We can really see a well right But what was what was the coolest white like an site flew from King. What was the coolest flight of the whole trip? While for Robin he he managed to fly from King.

01:00:03 - 01:05:05

We were we were in Cadeau. Casale Dakota thinking that we were Gonna fly there after we flew from Casper Wyoming and because it was the only weather that was even looked like it was horrible. So we diverted from Gillette Wyoming East Cadeau CA And we went too far to the east and got caught in too strong wind. So in rapid city was still north in wall. South Dakota Code. We saw a turn to the south and we should have stopped there and flown because over on transitionary boundary between the north and south. But we kept going another hour to the east and it was just blown Mike Stink. Twenty twenty five Guston thirty and so eventually. A smarter minds prevailed and we ended up not flying at all and then we did a thirteen hour drive to King Mountain Eh. Five thirty that night so to the pilots Glennon in drop back off in. Gillette said we're not going any further her driver and I made it to billings and we were to US white. Yes wiped DOC Robinson in his son Sasha made it type on say view in 'em and then they got up a got a little bit of a shuttle headed to king in. We were too far behind him to be able to climb up on the mountain. You know to get to the mountain in if you remember. I'm Robin Story. They get teen in. He's in a two two wheel drive. SUV driving up to a lower launch. And a a couldn't nurse one turn or something that you know that robot all washed out in the floods Couple of years ago and they still have to put it back together. So yeah I mean you. They can manage it but it's tough right now so they back back down in turned around and drove up in reverse in. We're able to get through the using now. The real drive to get up to launch in Robin I think he launched about four. PM In he'd been there before. Were you know itself. Kinda like many owns Bali at times and He said it was the most pleasant flight he'd had at king ever in just his favourite flight he was able again well about the mountain tops. Mount Dora kept heading heading up toward the snake. River valley rally past Trellis and that's a nice flight got K.. In the been talking to one of the locals while he was flying bet any said hey is going to get to the naked at Bali. And he's GonNa think man I can't go any further author but He said there's La's blow you can make it all away to salmon for us. Look at that point. But Robin didn't have that information ahead of time and and now as he put it decided it was time to land so he came down and landed at the in. Ellis I I believe themselves. Okay Okay Yeah so great flight for launch or off. So that's that's amazing. I mean when that Big Lost Valley Starts Boom l'ennemi we've had we've had some pretty newer pilots up at sixteen thousand feet at ten PM wondering how they're going to get down. The glass offs offs can be proper magic. It's it's that's pretty special Gavin. I should say one thing about Robin. He now I was probably the catalyst catalyst for starting this thing the most involved on on the planning side and then Robin was lockstep with me all the way through this in every morning and every night we were talking weather talking site. Where are we going so But the thing about Robin was is that he is just one tenacious pilot and he had three days. I believe it was three where we had all gone down and he was able to Stay up and fly for two or three hours more and so he really really pushed it for us to be able to make the whole journey. HAP was just a phenomenal flying that that he did. I'm just Wild by what he was able to accomplish in need any that guy on the team and really did our Sierra traverse way back in two thousand twelve oaks was Kinda my first big Bibi Nick. Greece pulled that weight while an Antoine Laurent. He's were guys that are far superior pilots in Iowa especially at that time and and Yeah we were playing baseball as well and there were days where I was really happy to have skies.

01:05:05 - 01:10:05

They could drive three fifty four and I said at the beginning that it was kind of folly that I thought I could do it by myself. And this is where a dawned on me that Larry Man this is a team game here is turned turned into a team game at with a very welcome team game so live in. I don't know how much more difficult it would be for for. Hang gliders to do this Emma I always think about Dustin and Janis flight. You know when they when when Dustin broke the record but they were together. You know the the stuff that's been going on down in Brazil and the surtout. I don't know if you watched all that into this fall but the you know the Brazilians have mastered the team flying. You know so there was just multiple five hundred plus twice a day after day after day and then the Brazilians just showed up one day the three of them together and destroyed it again. It was the same team that did it last night in the last world record. It's very clear that we gotta learn fly together and I think especially those of us in North America a little too cowboy and we don't do it you know we've all got our own opinions on how to do it together but I mean how do it alone in. We've got to learn how to stick together and and You know stick with that philosophy because it's all so so sexy that must have been an amazing day for both of those guys but imagine amazing would have been if they landed together. You know Dustin Johnny and because they were really flying off they were really kind of together and that would have been pretty cool for both of them right. I think I remember the end. Dustin caught a little fifty but permitted thermo when Johnny Actually told him. Hey I'm fifty foot per minute but Johnny Dolan in Dustin how is it like three hundred hundred foot advantage on them in fluent three miles further or whatever but one of the things. I wanted to mention about X.. Flight in the the last night for the first x flight inaugural on. Let's this I you know the the the thing that impressed me the most I and maybe watch too much. TV or something but had not one negative experience in the entire journey with people around us not one not a crossword was spoken number. One with you were friends. Better friends at the end than we were. When we began the the national our on in the crew not once did we have any any really any real tension or anxiety or are you know disagreements or whatever but the people that we interfaced with from the airports reports from the townsfolk everywhere? I told my wife when I got home. I said I have seen the real America. Wow now at. That is so good here so absolutely inspiring to me and it was exemplified by one flight in particular we were flying from mm-hmm from Hereford Texas. And we're GONNA go across the panhandle into Kansas. The Oklahoma panhandle in Kansas and again we got stopped by weather which almost every day we were stopped by. Weather wasn't by sunset does by weather but And this particular day we had excellent cloud. The streets were flying over this no-man's-land bit turned out to be not an issue. In an all of a sudden we went from seven eight hundred foot per minute climbs to ten thousand listen tree two hundred foot permit climbs. We're under the same cumulus clouds. Something Weird was happening but anyway we all push north as far as we could in than a salad. Colorado Qena started overshadow the ground that we were flying over so we knew it was gonna be over relatively soon in so we were debating whether we were and still in Texas or Oklahoma and now we weren't sure landed can island in a field by myself. It's still honk doc and twenty mile an hour winds on the surface. This I landed there in this field because they saw vehicles moving around in the field. Some Egg Cultural Cultural Work and I looked down wind and I didn't say anything and I thought man I'm GonNa land by people. I'm only going to get another three or four miles a Milan by people so I landed in this older woman. Probably my age comes out in this big pickup and says are you all right. I said Yeah I'm fine. She's do you need anything Nisa known in I said Ma'am am I in Texas. And she looked at me with this look interface and she says. I've never heard of that place. Place my Gosh that is awesome. Thought AH only out in their kids were yes salt of the earth.

01:10:05 - 01:15:16

You know I mean you know. Eleven year old boy stuck on my hip for the two hours. They're breaking down in in whatnot. When he shook my hand it was like shaking the end of a man he was just just? It was just amazing using amazed. It's it's awesome to hear that from you. You know as I travel quite a bit with flying. You know to mazing where paragliders take. It's amazing where paragliders take you and learn that one from from nate. But it's you know the the media and the you know where we are. Gist the polarization right now. And the political landscape and everything that's happening on just the guns in the schools and everything is the the all the stuff that people see outside of the US. I can understand why you know causing me as well. I'd like to come to pot and do that but gosh I don't WanNa get shot in. You know I live in Idaho. Everybody's armed and I have never once had a bad experience landing anywhere you know and it's just not I mean I'm sure I have landed in places where it wherever I land that person's not on the same you know like we probably wouldn't be friends on facebook but we're friends in person you know and I just this social media's terrorists apart it really is and it's that's great to hear because you really were in middle America and in the people are also yeah. Yeah it was a fantastic fantastic trip on that particular today so landed right in the really reaffirming and that has to leave you in a more optimistic place. That's great the great thing about trowel sometimes Vic Nick Larry let me ask you what you just keep going forever. This is terrific but let me ask you a question that I ask a lot of our a a lot of the people I've had on the show. If you could rewind the clock and this is going way back for you buddy. The if you could rewind the clock to your fifty our piloting reading self What advice do you wish you would have gotten then? I'm assuming somewhere along the line. There's been some close calls or some accidents or or something but what what would you. You've seen a lot certainly in your career. What would you have changed if any You know I was somewhat somewhat of a loner pilot in that in Illinois. There weren't a lot. There wasn't a lot of experience in not a lot of flying going on so so most of the things that I did I had to learn on my own. And so fortunately able to Kinda come through the The keyhole in emerge from the other side and the shape of the key. I call an Amorphous Blob. Going in you know same shape me to to Survived I guess is probably the best thing to say but so if I had to do it over again I would have thought more for more mentoring more instruction and I did learn that later. I mean there wasn't that long ago I went back to the training. Hilda all due to fly my hang glider and people are like. Why are you doing that? I somehow not satisfied with the way. Land in my glider. Some repetition When you fly sea in you have one one launch in land for hours later you only get one landing in you do that? Maybe twenty twenty times a year. And you don't have You know that's not enough repetition to perfect your landing skill so yeah I wished I had taught more experienced instruction too so that I could be come a safer pilot in. I think I was on on the safety side but there were a couple incidents that I had that I was pretty lucky so I lied. I'M GONNA ask you one more question in it. We had this show while back with Bruce Waiver in a bunch of folks that was pretty fascinating can focus on the future hang gliding. Where do you see it going? Apollo hit still slowly dying. I know that will swing is really working. Hard to try and get the Beginning side a the much easier than that is. The lower fair gliding is said The convenience of carrying a bag around with you in being able to open it up and flying The ease with which it is to learn a flyer at least it's apparent meaning or it seems that way to me. We need to kind of get that back. I know that what the development of the Alpha Glider that Steve has designed when that is helpful. But yeah I I still think we've got a long a tough long tough road to go down in order for hang gliding to turn around because it's on a slower slow decline any of your kids by my.

01:15:17 - 01:20:04

My son tried it as a graduation. The present he did a tandem in you know maybe that goes back to my China might safety conscious self and why just taken baby steps might whole flying in career. I obviously are definitely knew the hazards and the risks associated with hang gliding especially in the beginning when we had no oh safety devices. That could take you out of a dive. I think I kind of pushed him away from that not purposefully but now when I look back on it I think it was somewhat but it wasn't a covert thing on my part to say that no you don't. You're not hang gliding but I'm in the interesting thing. Missile came with me on all my journeys many would come out and watch me fly and then we go home and McDonnell. They're a much more conventional sports in now. Their kids are in a conventional sports. I keep selling interesting to take out to the mud bog and let them get their fingers dirty and other urges you to structured for me. But you know that's not good. Is it if your kids don't they don't then. We're not on the right trajectory there. S We gotta we gotTA figure out how to get the kids into it pretty special. You know they've they have figured out in France and Switzerland and you know there's you can go to school and learn how to fly. It's credit for college. There's mentors and Coaches D.. And you can make a living doing it. I mean imagine that we we do have a On one fellow that Scott Business in Wisconsin. He's gotTA lease on an airport That he's doing it's gotTa Training Hill on it. So they do training raining They do introductory training lessons on the hill. They do tandem flights behind the behind the tow plane in does that six months. A year from Wisconsin. In now he bought Sonora Wings in Arizona. Any student the other six months Current you know southwest west of Phoenix in So it and it's it's slow but he's building in were hopeful more. I hope I mean great. Not a very positive statement for hang gliding but ban. I can't I'm they can't give it up as for here. You can hear it in your voice pay. I do There was one story. I wanted to mention You know as we migrated west to avoid bad weather we went to Casper Wyoming and I mentioned earlier. Fine from whiskey Pete in so I was able to find Kevin Having Christoffersen who had set the record back in the eighties. A world record and I found my facebook contacted him. We're actually GONNA fly out of an airport in the valley down below Casper The city of Casper To the east of the main airport is like a might have been a county. Airport is just the grass strip got permission apply from there and then Kevin contacted me said hey common fly from my my runway in the foothills so the Casper amount okay. So I called them in. We ended up migrating up there to his place and always was his driveway into his beautiful own but We've we flew from there and it was not the probably the the riskiest towing that we had done the entire trip But anyway it was so fun to be able to fly at with this man who was a former world record holder still flying lighters trikes enough And he was given us the confidence to fly the route that we were. We were intending going off to the northeast because it was somewhat a tiger country. I know it. It was tiger country in the eighty S. When I was in there less so now because of all the fragging that's going on so there are a lot more road on there but you know that doesn't necessarily mean accessible assessable Lock Gates around He gave us the confidence to go. And we had a remarkable flight until another son Shut us down about eighty miles out but fun fun time it was fun revisiting with him To see the him still have the passion in Harry Martin came out. He lives on the other side of Casper mountain. He's the guy that does all of the the the comic are enough useful magazine. Oh he was there in. Yeah it Eliza. Another highlight of the trip Scher netted the last piece.

01:20:04 - 01:25:08

I'll give us when we were flying into the Dorthy. I'll shoot dorothy. Dorothy Scott Airport up at the Canadian border in Washington I called the airport ahead as I did every day and said hey we think we're GonNa GonNa Oregon apply to your to your airport that okay. Great great or Robin there but didn't dip his wing into Canada so we all went up there on the last day to where he landed in then in flew into Canada and I was talking to the airport manager who is in the seventies and he says. I'm surprised you guys are here. I said well. What do you mean while I was reading about you online? I said we'll worry about a son X.. Fight he goes no. I was just reading some aviation stuff than I normally read Talking about hang-gliders finding the Canada. And like are you kidding. You know so it always Kinda cool. I mean we started out with just this little group. That was just GonNa do this for ourselves and really weren't looking at too much Acknowledgement men are are are interface in than we brought on the Susan G Komen Foundation to try and get back to the community somewhat in by the way they ended up. I was over thirty thirty thousand dollars that we were able to donate to that foundation out of or at least and that's fair breast cancer. Trust yes okay and Robin one was a huge instigator in getting that going in a huge driver and making it happen for sure and But you know we created that facebook group page in. We started out with twenty five members. Then I ice kicked it off like a month and by the time we started we had like two hundred members and then we had five hundred nine seven hundred eleven hundred and we're all just Lord it's like Holy Crap. Hey we fly. Well you know trash her on the interesting thing for me was that probably third to Maybe only percent of the people that joined up weren't even from the US they were from around really. Yeah that was to me just it was. It was word of mouth. You know somebody would say hey you need to check this out so we ended up with almost twelve hundred members in. We're still sign up today. So yeah it was as a cool mission and he told the story really well then fantastic this place that you guys started that You mentioned near that some of the parallels were looking at and maybe trying to build an encampment effort down there for world record. visit just is still better because there's a lot of people also internationally. That really are dying to come over. Because of what's going on in Brazil Mel we all believe and I have been there but I mean that the rumor is on a good day we go better go farther than they're what they're doing now in Brazil absolute missile. I'd I'd actually kinda liked to spend a month down there to kind of take advantage of things but fell which is between Referral which is northeast of Corpus. Christi on Calvary. This is south west of Corpus Christi. And then there's the potter Or right on the edge of what I would call the Mesquite Mass Yep and fell furriest was challenging. But for you guys who wouldn't be it wouldn't be challenging at all And I never flew over an area where I didn't have land mandible. Field said I could put down in. So it's not a as much tire country as Papa in Zapata. I think you'd probably still it. You just have less margin for error in Zapata transom. My experiences listening to others Persson also looking at Google maps but Foul furious would be an awesome place to to take off from In and I know Dustin knows he. He's got places picked out where he thinks that he can go. And instead the world record for sure but yeah the benefits to file for is tonight. I say this about any competition. You need a a good place to fly from a mountain or or a good airport or whatever but then you need the infrastructure that that can support people that are there so you're not driving an hour you know. Rent it to the place or whatever. Yeah in Ferries head multiple hotels. Carrie compensating You know the airport was accommodating as well. It's it's massive so ray at a really good good. Hi Toe and I think in this is contrary to what others believe Zapata is a little bit landlocked.

01:25:09 - 01:30:23

So you don't get As many As Much Cumulus Development Oh interesting referral and fell. furriest you're much more likely to get cumulus development but anyway my my my thinking is in Dustin may have a better insight inset South Korea's could be better than Potter because you get your cloud street overrun Much more frequently. So yeah you always fly Basser cloud outfits pod you're not GonNa get the overrun Interesting East you may not 'cause there's a lot of land in between you and the Gulf yeah rich in foul furriest said you know. The Golf's not that far away so in an referral we had called streets every day. We never had a blue day day there. But well because you're further east urine wetter country and so there's a trade off between how high you're GONNA get versus Yeah there's a story in itself. Johnny Duran was fine with us at referred real is fine at Kinko's glider sport glider in He launched a course. He's got a lot of experience as a pot he's like. Hey what are we waiting for. It's time to go. We got called streets so yeah but they don't look that high he said it doesn't matter you just get up to the top and you just stay there all okay. So it's nine. AM He calls on the radio. Says Mac Mech he says I met cloud-based at sixteen hundred but I don't know that the street which street looks better. I'm on I'm in the street to the to the East is the street to the West. Look better in mccower says will johnny. I think it does. It does look better. Johnny goes okay. Thanks crosses the street from sixteen hundred she gets to the street. I don't know what altitude he was a horse back up and he's gone and that is that is supreme confidence in confidence that he's he's the in our world that's critical. Just the moves he makes over and over and over again you like. How did you have the confidence to do? Yeah the Gavin Banks Man. I'm I'm glad I could share with you. What I know about exploitation what we did? Yeah thank you so much Congrat- to your team the projects for those of you. Who are interested? Look it up. It's a it's on facebook. It's called ex- flight Gulf to Canada. They did it was twenty one days. Eleven states nobre eighteen eighteen hundred miles for pilots. Look just cool Larry Congratulations. I hope this is the first of many exploits and I hope I get to fly with you guys. I know there's just so much knowledge there that I would love to tap into and share with our listeners as well but thanks for sharing your story story this was a true pleasure. If you find the cloud base may have valuable you can supported in a lot of different ways you can give a rating on itunes or stitcher however you get your podcast. That goes a long ways to help. Spread the word you can blog about it on your own website or shared on social shaw media. You can talk about it on the way to launch with your pilot friends. I know a lot of interesting conversations of happened that way and of course you can support US financially. This show does take a lot all the time. A lot of editing lot of storage and music and all kinds of behind the scenes cost so if you can support US financially always ever ask for a buck show and you can do do that through a one time donation through paypal or you can set up a subscription service that charges you for each show that comes out. We put a new show out every two weeks. So for example Apple. If you did a buck show and every two weeks it'd be about twenty five dollars a year so way cheaper than a magazine subscription and it makes all this possible I do not want to fund this show with with advertising or sponsors. We get asked about that Pretty frequently but I for a whole bunch of different reasons which I've said many times on the show. I don't WanNa do that. I don't like to have in that stuff at the front of the show. Oh an awesome. Want you to know that these are authentic conversations with real people and these are just our opinions but our opinions are not being skewed by sponsors or advertising dollars. I think that's a pretty toxic business model so I hope you dig that you can support us if you go to cloud base May dot com. You can find the places to support. You can do it through Patriot dot com for slash. cloud-based mayhem if you WANNA recurring subscription. You can also do that directly through the website. We've tried to make it really easy and that will give you access to all all the bonus material a little video cast that we deal and extra little nuggets that we find in conversations that don't make it into the main show but we feel like you should hear we don't put any of that behind a paywall if you can't afford to support us than just let me know and I'll set you up with an account of course that'll be lifetime and hopefully you're being in a position some day to be able to support us but you'll find all that on the website All of you who have supported us or even joined our newsletter or bought cloud-based mayhem merchandise t shirts hats or anything.

01:30:23 - 01:30:40

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